IRC logs for #aegir, 2011-08-25 (GMT)

2011-08-24
2011-08-26
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[10:15:45]<skwashd_>fiasco: i am now
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[10:57:42]<fiasco>skwashd_, tag!
[10:58:04]<skwashd_>fiasco: about to go into a meeting
[10:58:16]<fiasco>skwashd_, when will you be back?
[10:58:29]<skwashd_>14:30NZST
[10:58:46]<fiasco>skwashd_, ok, I can wait till then :) ping me?
[11:01:40]<skwashd_>sure
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[11:09:16]<snlnz>fiasco: are you from NZ?
[11:09:22]<fiasco>snlnz, yes
[11:09:36]<snlnz>cool nice one! :)
[11:09:46]<snlnz>likewise
[11:09:57]<fiasco>snlnz, where? I'm in Wellington
[11:10:02]<snlnz>Northland
[11:10:09]<snlnz>grew up in stinky auckland
[11:10:32]<snlnz>I love Wellington
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[11:12:23]<fiasco>snlnz, oh wow, northland. cool. Doing Aegir stuff up there?
[11:12:35]<snlnz>sure am! :)
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[11:15:05]<snlnz>fiasco: is this you? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ358pMBD1o
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[12:26:50]<skwashd_>fiasco: ping!
[12:27:19]<fiasco>sk33lz, you're early!
[12:27:27]<fiasco>skwashd_, pm?
[12:27:28]<skwashd_>:)
[12:27:30]<skwashd_>sure
[12:27:40]<sk33lz>sup?
[12:28:24]<skwashd_>sk33lz: fiasco doesn't have l337 !R< 5k1llz
[12:28:44]<sk33lz>lol
[12:28:44]<fiasco>whoops. sorry
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[12:29:13]<sk33lz>what am I early for?
[12:29:21]<skwashd_>sk33lz: i finished a meeting early
[12:29:53]<sk33lz>oh, misfire on a tab name lol
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[20:11:52]<romaingar>Hello is Aegir use a ssh tunnel for connect to mysql remote servers ?
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[20:51:42]<halcyonCorsair>romaingar: i don't believe so, no
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[21:34:46]<root_____>Hi, can anyone help with accessing the /var/aegir/platforms folder using samba?
[21:38:32]<root_____>I can access the share though I can't seem to use the aegir user even with giving it a smbpasswd
[21:39:08]<root_____>and I've tried chown'n the folder with another user but this breaks aegir
[21:41:42]<root_____>?
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[21:51:08]<romaingar>halcyonCorsair : thanks
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[22:28:56]<root_____>I guess no one can help?
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[23:15:48]<halcyonCorsair>omega8cc: hi
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[23:20:46]<omega8cc>halcyonCorsair: hello
[23:22:30]<halcyonCorsair>omega8cc: back to working on my solr service stuff
[23:22:54]<halcyonCorsair>just wondering if there is a 'canonical' service, as some of the services seem to do things quite differently...
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[23:28:46]<omega8cc>halcyonCorsair: they differ obviously, because, for example, http and database stuff is different, then there are service types, like apache and nginx etc, so there is no 'generic' service to use and if you want yo add your own, you probably need to clone some existing and modify it to match your needs for integration, also, I didn't had a time to check your code yet, but plan to do that soon
[23:29:24]<halcyonCorsair>right...i'll push some updates and go to bed soon
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[23:29:47]<halcyonCorsair>i'm thinking taking modified bits of the db code is most like what i want
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[23:31:04]<omega8cc>probably yes, as http is to complex for your needs
[23:31:12]<omega8cc>too*
[23:32:09]<anarcat>hello!
[23:32:31]<omega8cc>halcyonCorsair: there is also the example service, but maybe starting with cloning db will be easier
[23:32:38]<omega8cc>anarcat: hi!
[23:33:03]<halcyonCorsair>omega8cc: more that i want to generate a name and create a thing, as opposed to just blatting over templated files
[23:33:07]<anarcat>hello omega8cc how is it going
[23:33:21]<halcyonCorsair>ugh >:( why is apachesolr storing things in the db in 7? what a step backwards
[23:33:49]<omega8cc>anarcat: seen the session but why the session video includes only slides and voice? I'm dissappointed :p
[23:35:27]<omega8cc>anarcat: anyway, congrats! good job with the session!
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[23:36:03]<anarcat>omega8cc: it was a small room, we're not in the cool crowd :P
[23:36:07]<anarcat>but thanks!
[23:36:26]<omega8cc>darthsteven: ^^
[23:37:11]<omega8cc>anarcat: it was very nice, and the aegir re-install was a funny add-on
[23:37:56]<anarcat>nice to hear that :)
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[23:38:34]<omega8cc>anarcat: rebels don't follow the crowd, it is the crowd who follow us ;)
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[23:40:29]<omega8cc>anarcat: plus, since Koumbit is an org and we are opensourced, we are safe from being Acquiared ;)
[23:41:29]<omega8cc>they still can buy mig5 or darthsteven, but let's hope it will not happen, haha
[23:41:35]<halcyonCorsair>anarcat: you did a talk? (i'm not really keeping up with DC london)
[23:43:52]<omega8cc>halcyonCorsair: http://london2011.drupal.org/conference/sessions/aegir-one-drupal-rule-t...
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[23:44:35]<anarcat>omega8cc: :)
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[00:15:23]<skwashd_>halcyonCorsair: this might be useful for your solr core stuff http://davehall.com.au/blog/dave/2010/06/26/multi-core-apache-solr-ubunt...
[00:17:31]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd_: omega8cc pointed that out, but we've got the webserver specifically disabled as a potential security risk
[00:17:42]<darthsteven>omega8cc: Did you like the session?
[00:17:57]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd_: err, solr web service i mean
[00:18:14]<skwashd_>halcyonCorsair: then how do you make requests to solr?
[00:18:53]<omega8cc>darthsteven: yes! thanks for that, good job!
[00:19:09]<skwashd_>halcyonCorsair: your solr node/s should be properly firewalled anyway
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[00:19:46]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd_: what can i say, to make our life easier, we're making our life harder...
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[00:20:34]<skwashd_>that didn't answer my question about how you can communicate with solr if you disable the web service
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[00:27:00]<skwashd>halcyonCorsair: do you work with fiasco at Catalyst?
[00:27:20]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd: that i do :) which makes it mental for me to be up at this hour
[00:27:55]<skwashd>halcyonCorsair: i was talking to him about how catalyst handles solr today
[00:28:17]<skwashd>amongst other things
[00:29:33]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd: yeah, we have a debian packaged version of it called apollo
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[00:29:47]<skwashd>yeah
[00:29:53]<skwashd>he was telling me about it
[00:31:22]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd: if you're interested, you can see my awful and awfully not working code, and what i'm trying to do, here: https://github.com/halcyonCorsair/aegir_solr_service
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[00:31:45]<skwashd>halcyonCorsair: i looked the apollo ITP ... rsync based replicaton? why not 1.4 native?
[00:32:00]<halcyonCorsair>ITP?
[00:32:13]<skwashd>debian intention to package bug report
[00:32:51]<skwashd>oh it is 3 years old http://bugs.debian.org/492157
[00:32:58]<halcyonCorsair>heh
[00:33:26]<halcyonCorsair>yeah, we've recently done some update work, so i'm fairly sure it would use 1.4 native now
[00:33:40]<halcyonCorsair>although i can't claim knowledge of the inner workings :)
[00:35:53]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd: i don't suppose you can shed light on why the apachesolr ppl now want to store the solr config in the db for D7?
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[00:37:37]<skwashd>halcyonCorsair: d6 does it too http://drupalcode.org/project/apachesolr.git/blob/6d8159515f14bcbd285993...
[00:38:41]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd: d7 doesn't do this any more: variable_get('apachesolr_host', 'localhost'),
[00:38:53]<skwashd>dunno
[00:38:58]<skwashd>does it support ctools?
[00:39:02]<halcyonCorsair>so no more $conf['apachesolr_host'] = 'my_host'; so far as i can tell
[00:39:05]<halcyonCorsair>not sure
[00:39:20]<skwashd>if it supports ctools it is no big loss imo
[00:40:00]<halcyonCorsair>doesn't look like it at the moment, unless i'm missing something
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[00:40:42]<skwashd>halcyonCorsair: still uses {variable} http://drupalcode.org/project/apachesolr.git/blob/6878a6de6f1978a1fafd99...
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[00:42:06]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd: sadly not for the useful variables
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[00:46:17]<skwashd>halcyonCorsair: it is stored in {apachesolr_environment}
[00:46:40]<skwashd>halcyonCorsair: i have no idea if it supports ctools exportables or not
[00:46:53]<skwashd>if it doesn't prepare a patch
[00:47:01]<skwashd>then you can use features for it :)
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[00:50:50]<halcyonCorsair>skwashd: do you know how to get a queued task to run *now* ?
[00:51:24]<skwashd>halcyonCorsair: set the queue to run 100 tasks per second then run drush cron :)
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[00:57:27]<halcyonCorsair>hmm...seems stuck...
[00:57:41]<halcyonCorsair>ah...fuck this, i need some minimal sleep, so i'm off to bed
[00:57:43]<halcyonCorsair>ttyl
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[02:59:14]<anarcat>mig5: i submitted the gsoc submission
[03:00:03]<realityloop>omega8cc: I'm working on getting nginx + aegir working on OS X, currently getting redirected to install.php and shown 403 forbidden.. any ideas?
[03:03:23]<omega8cc>realityloop: no idea, we all at omega8.cc are mac users, but we use debian only for any aegir related stuff, anyway, redirect to install.php can be either A. permissions issue or B. vhost points to platform root with no site available in /sites/
[03:04:15]<realityloop>omega8cc: aegir installation worked.. just nginx issue and I think it'll be good to go
[03:04:33]<realityloop>planning to do a blog post with entire process
[03:04:53]<omega8cc>have you checked if the path in the vhost points to really installed site?
[03:05:30]<omega8cc>if yes, and permissions are correct, just force Nginx restart maybe
[03:05:51]<realityloop>omega8cc: how can I confirm the perms are correct?
[03:06:52]<realityloop>omega8cc: hostmaster.../sites/ = drwxr-xr-x 9 aegir _www 306 25 Aug 17:50 aegir.ld
[03:06:55]<omega8cc>realityloop: ls -la /path/to/platform/sites/domain/settings.php
[03:07:16]<realityloop>-r--r----- 1 aegir _www 3027 25 Aug 17:50 settings.php
[03:07:45]<omega8cc>ok, and the path to hostmaster platform in the vhost is correct?
[03:08:23]<omega8cc>what is the _www group? not just www?
[03:09:01]<omega8cc>is this the group your php-fpm runs?
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[03:09:50]<omega8cc>ah
[03:09:55]<omega8cc>mac osx
[03:10:01]<omega8cc>sure, it is normal
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[03:10:31]<realityloop>root /var/aegir/hostmaster-6.x-1.2;
[03:11:46]<omega8cc>realityloop: so you created the symlink to include vhosts created by Aegir?
[03:11:52]<realityloop>yes
[03:12:28]<omega8cc>and nginx has been restarted manually?
[03:13:17]<realityloop>I restarted the machine
[03:13:33]<realityloop>but just restarted manually too: sudo /usr/local/sbin/nginx -s reload
[03:13:43]<omega8cc>hmm.. then no idea, it should work..
[03:14:11]<realityloop>CHANGELOG.txt loads
[03:14:34]<realityloop>lookslike any .php redirects to install.php
[03:16:39]<omega8cc>could you try the boost_stats.php file (you need to create it with php info inside) in the platform root to see if php works as designed?
[03:18:00]<realityloop>omega8cc: that loads
[03:18:37]<realityloop>I wonder if the DB is ok..
[03:18:49]<realityloop>just downloading sequel pro.. this is in a VM
[03:20:15]<omega8cc>it shouldn't redirect to install if db access has issues, instead, should give you just error 503 generated by drupal
[03:20:24]<realityloop>ah.. ok
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[03:22:09]<omega8cc>so either some permissions (maybe on parent dirs) are wrong or it is some extra magic from our beloved osx..
[03:22:50]<realityloop>omega8cc: are the perms in relation to nginx.. or just the files in /var/aegir ?
[03:23:26]<ghankstef>realityloop: not an nginx guy but when i get redirect to install.php usually means the site dir does not have a dir or symlink for a given domain
[03:23:36]<omega8cc>wait, if the boost_stats.php works then permissions are correct
[03:24:18]<realityloop>omega8cc: any suggestions what else I can look at then?
[03:25:35]<omega8cc>are you sure the path to /var/aegir/hostmaster-6.x-1.2/sites/domain.name exists and /var/aegir/hostmaster-6.x-1.2/sites/domain.name is readable? we checked settings.php file only so far
[03:26:02]<omega8cc>what is the result of ls -la /var/aegir/hostmaster-6.x-1.2/sites/domain.name
[03:26:06]<realityloop>omega8cc: /var/aegir/hostmaster-6.x-1.2/sites/aegir.ld
[03:26:48]<realityloop>omega8cc: http://pastebin.com/wAkKHDSQ
[03:27:56]<omega8cc>it looks fine
[03:28:58]<realityloop>I'm just using the default nginx.conf with added include for include /usr/local/etc/nginx/aegir.conf;
[03:30:34]<realityloop>I did have to comment out 2 lines though
[03:30:43]<omega8cc>if the boost_stats.php works then both nginx vhost and php works, what is your nginx version?
[03:30:53]<omega8cc>2 lines?
[03:30:56]<omega8cc>why?
[03:31:54]<realityloop>1.0.5
[03:32:01]<realityloop># gzip_proxied any;
[03:32:01]<realityloop># gzip_types text/plain text/css text/javascript applic...
[03:32:03]<omega8cc>please pastebin your vhost and what you have in /var/aegir/config/includes/nginx_advanced_include.conf
[03:32:07]<realityloop>errored otherwise
[03:32:41]<omega8cc>these lines are safe to disable, shouldn't matter
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[03:36:33]<realityloop>omega8cc: http://pastebin.com/3ZQXK1y3
[03:37:30]<realityloop>omega8cc: http://pastebin.com/c615SP6G
[03:38:08]<realityloop>rl:aegir.ld aegir$ ls -la /var/aegir/config/server_master/nginx/vhost.d/aegir.ld
[03:38:09]<realityloop>-rw-r--r-- 1 aegir _www 399 Aug 25 17:50 /var/aegir/config/server_master/nginx/vhost.d/aegir.ld
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[03:42:51]<omega8cc>all permissions look fine, weird
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[03:45:24]<realityloop>I thought so
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[03:45:46]<realityloop>drwx------ 2 aegir _www 68 Aug 25 08:43 platform.d
[03:45:47]<realityloop>drwx------ 2 aegir _www 68 Aug 25 08:43 post.d
[03:45:47]<realityloop>drwx------ 2 aegir _www 68 Aug 25 08:43 pre.d
[03:45:48]<realityloop>drwx------ 3 aegir _www 102 Aug 25 17:50 vhost.d
[03:46:03]<omega8cc>wow
[03:46:17]<realityloop>^ though this must be ok, or wouldn't be able to access istes at all would I?
[03:46:55]<realityloop>wow?
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[03:48:01]<omega8cc>normally it should be aegir:aegir, but permissions are correct, as Nginx normally starts with configs/vhost loaded as root
[03:49:13]<omega8cc>and if it shows both static and php file, then the nginx/php/perms are correct
[03:49:22]<realityloop>thought so..
[03:49:34]<omega8cc>so
[03:49:46]<omega8cc>does the database exist?
[03:50:18]<omega8cc>maybe I was wrong with 503 - it gives 503 when credentials down't work
[03:50:25]<omega8cc>don't*
[03:52:00]<omega8cc>so maybe it redirects because there is no database created
[03:52:19]<realityloop>there is a database
[03:52:52]<realityloop>I need to confirm user got created though.. there were no errors using --debug when I instaled hostmaster though
[03:54:25]<omega8cc>yeah, check if user/pass for db access work, however it should give 503 and not redirect to install, I think
[03:57:45]<omega8cc>unless I'm wrong and 503 is only when password or host is wrong, while non-existing db user or db will result with redirect to install, no idea, never tried that
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[04:00:52]<realityloop>omega8cc: DB has data, and user has acces to the table :/
[04:01:37]<realityloop>perms for everything except grant
[04:02:30]<omega8cc>if it is created by install script and not by hand, then it should be correct
[04:02:36]<realityloop>it was
[04:02:42]<realityloop>by script I mean
[04:03:02]<realityloop>I received the email with onetime login link too
[04:03:26]<realityloop>using php 5.3.7 if that ha any bearing on things
[04:04:47]<omega8cc>what is the result of curl -I aegir.ld
[04:05:08]<omega8cc>hmm, not sure about 5.3
[04:05:16]<omega8cc>we use 5.2
[04:05:29]<omega8cc>but it shouldn't matter here
[04:07:38]<realityloop>http://pastebin.com/fGEUj9wm
[04:08:48]<omega8cc>yeah, so it is not any cache thing but real response from drupal
[04:09:22]<realityloop>weird.. I wonder whT COULD CAUSE THAT
[04:09:27]<realityloop>oops
[04:09:30]<omega8cc>so, how you run php there?
[04:09:50]<omega8cc>is it php-fpm?
[04:09:59]<realityloop>yes via a plist /System/Library/LaunchDaemons/org.homebrew.php-fpm.plist
[04:10:11]<realityloop>here is the contents http://realityloop.com/sites/realityloop.com/files/uploads/php-fpm.plist...
[04:11:43]<omega8cc>ok, I suspect your php-fpm doesn't run as _www group
[04:11:55]<realityloop>no it doesn't..
[04:12:01]<realityloop>let me try and change
[04:12:13]<omega8cc>yeah, so settings.php is nor readable then
[04:12:24]<omega8cc>and gives redirect
[04:12:37]<omega8cc>not* readable
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[04:15:30]<realityloop>omega8cc: in php-fpm.conf..
[04:15:34]<realityloop>user = nobody
[04:15:34]<realityloop>group = nobody
[04:16:06]<realityloop>changed and restarting
[04:16:07]<omega8cc>yeah, it should be _www:_www
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[04:17:39]<realityloop>yay!! thats fixed it..
[04:17:49]<realityloop>thanks Grace
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[04:21:50]<omega8cc>np
[04:21:59]<realityloop>I really appreciate your help
[04:22:46]<omega8cc>we need to document it better, maybe you could add it in the docs on c.a.o?
[04:23:19]<realityloop>omega8cc: we plan to document the whole process of setting it up on OS X usin nginx
[04:23:35]<realityloop>that was the final outstanding problem in the process
[04:23:44]<omega8cc>great, then post it on c.a.o :)
[04:24:47]<realityloop>we will a soon as we clean up documentation and retest process from scratch
[04:28:49]<realityloop>I'm off to get dinner now.. bye
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[05:16:31]<pomliane>hefring: logpointer?
[05:16:41]<pomliane>hefring: log pointer?
[05:16:41]<hefring>http://hefring.mig5.net/bot/log/aegir/2011-08-25#T108368
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[05:43:46]<pomliane>hello
[05:43:46]<hefring>bonjour
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[07:18:32]<chrowe>can BOA run install using php 5.3?
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[07:32:16]<mig5>wow those videos go up fast at this drupalcon don't they!
[07:32:30]<mig5>settling in to watch now ;) i heard there was a nice big demo fail? :)
[07:32:51]<mig5>we should make that a tradition
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[07:34:04]<realityloop>darthsteven: hows your bind fu?
[07:34:29]<darthsteven>realityloop: bind?
[07:34:36]<darthsteven>realityloop: I kid!
[07:34:40]<darthsteven>realityloop: awful
[07:34:52]<darthsteven>realityloop: anarcat is the one you're after
[07:35:02]<realityloop>darthsteven: thanks
[07:35:30]<realityloop>darthsteven: he'll be at sprints tomorrow?
[07:35:34]<darthsteven>realityloop: he'll be at the code sprint tomorrow if you want to pick is brains
[07:35:41]<darthsteven>*his
[07:35:43]<realityloop>snap! cheers
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[07:43:23]<omega8cc>chrowe: no (not yet) because many distros use contrib modules not yet compatible with 5.3
[07:44:46]<omega8cc>mig5: right, it was funny, especially when the install has been made so apt-easy
[07:45:22]<mig5>i like antoine 'this one will actually work' :)
[07:45:31]<omega8cc>haha
[07:45:52]<darthsteven>http://drupal.org/node/1260186
[07:45:52]<hefring>http://drupal.org/node/1260186 => Make a screencast of installing Aegir => Provision, Documentation, normal, active, 0 comments, 1 IRC mention
[07:46:09]<darthsteven>to 'solve' that issue for non-core Aegir people doing presentations :)
[07:47:13]<realityloop>darthsteven: using the deb?
[07:47:43]<omega8cc>darthsteven: lots of nice ideas in the queue! Skynet activation is clearly coming
[07:48:29]<darthsteven>realityloop: I think that's the one that we'd demo
[07:49:10]<darthsteven>omega8cc: yeah, mostly from a chat with realityloop last night, | made a list and everything
[07:49:48]<omega8cc>darthsteven: great
[07:50:36]<mig5>didn't i do a million screencasts once :)
[07:50:41]<mig5>they go out of date so quick that's the problem
[07:51:19]<realityloop>darthsteven: http://drupal.org/node/1259098#comment-4907668
[07:51:20]<hefring>http://drupal.org/node/1259098 => nginx HTTP service should support different restart commands => Provision, Code, normal, active, 5 comments, 1 IRC mention
[07:51:29]<mig5>i think i'd rather watch a live demo even if it fails: it's more exciting :)
[07:51:42]<darthsteven>mig5: yeah, but maybe we should make an effort to keep certain ones up to date
[07:52:01]<darthsteven>mig5: I know that most of us were 'on-ramped' to Aegir by your screencasts
[07:52:15]<darthsteven>mig5: they are possibly the single best thing about the wider Aegir project
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[07:52:52]* mig5 chuckling at anarcat cackling at his demo fail :)
[07:54:03]<mig5>infectious :)
[07:54:11]<darthsteven>mig5: about watching the fail, there was a presentation about something here at Drupalcon that experienced epic fail, and people were saying it was 'like the Aegir presentations'. This is not a good thing to be known for.
[07:54:47]<omega8cc>mig5: https://skitch.com/omega8cc/fu51a/t7gfyr-1.jpg
[07:55:00]<mig5>i wonder if we can loop the mysql root password prompt in the installer
[07:55:08]<mig5>e.g it tries to login and if it fails, loop until we get it right
[07:55:12]<mig5>then continue
[07:55:23]<mig5>that is one for anarcat in his deb packages :) i don't even know if it's possible
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[07:56:22]<mig5>looks like a nice setup: I can't believe anarcat got the project to work with his crazy AwesomeWM :)
[07:56:39]<omega8cc>that is why we automated it completely in BOA, all prompts silenced behind the scene ;)
[07:57:20]<mig5>yeah but debian packages are 'special'
[07:57:25]<omega8cc>yeah
[07:57:27]<mig5>and have to obey certain rules, theoretically :)
[07:57:46]<omega8cc>it could be tricky
[07:58:09]<mig5>plus you might already have mysql installed, so we need to prompt for a possibly existing passwd
[07:59:23]<omega8cc>exactly
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[08:08:19]<mig5>i really hate 'doesn't work' reports
[08:08:27]<mig5>what a useless thing to say
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[08:13:05]<darthsteven>omega8cc, mig5: you can just pre-seed the debian packages with the passwords
[08:13:16]<darthsteven>or type the word 'password' correctly :)
[08:13:22]<darthsteven>or use a one letter password
[08:13:53]<omega8cc>one letter password wins!
[08:14:28]<darthsteven>omega8cc: maybe use an external USB input device that just has one key on it, so you can't mis-type it
[08:14:42]<darthsteven>anarcat did a great job of recovering from the fail though
[08:15:25]<omega8cc>yep, it looked like "by design"!
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[08:20:50]* mig5 epic fails all over the issue queue
[08:20:55]<mig5>sigh
[08:22:11]<omega8cc>mig5: more coffee :)
[08:23:05]<mig5>yeah..
[08:24:01]<mig5>i'd patch that login link thing but i've never understood the branches we have these days :)
[08:24:09]<mig5>or when to merge back into 6.x-1.x anyway
[08:24:16]<mig5>i have not had coffee at all yet: that's the problem
[08:24:21]* mig5 goes to fix that
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[08:34:24]<mig5>that was a good presentation guys, just watched the whole thing
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[09:47:46]<darthsteven>mig5: Would appreciate any feedback on the presentation, including different presenters etc. :) or more content
[09:48:17]<darthsteven>Or less content.
[09:50:38]<mig5>i don't think i'd change the presenters, you both did well. I only have ever done it once before, and i actually thought you were more at ease talking to an audience than I was
[09:50:59]<mig5>i needed Rescue Remedy minutes before San Francisco as I was having an anxiety attack about it :)
[09:53:06]<mig5>the same old questions come up each time: especially re: dev/stage/live. i wonder if we need to publish an Aegir Workflow Standard or something and demonstrate an actual dev/stage/live of a dummy website
[09:53:18]<mig5>but like all demonstrations, they can backfire :)
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