IRC logs for #aegir, 2012-06-20 (GMT)

2012-06-19
2012-06-21
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[14:12:44]<grobot>what's the juice on aegir + ssl + wildcard certs?
[14:13:15]<grobot>docs at http://community.aegirproject.org/node/29 may be out of date (1.7 doesn't seem to create ssl.d directories, at least)?
[14:14:23]<bgm>grobot: that doc seems OK
[14:15:07]<grobot>ok. been asked to look at someone else's aegir, and they didn't get ssl.d created following those instructions
[14:15:13]<grobot>thought i should ask before blazing ahead
[14:15:21]<bgm>aegir creates a key in /var/aegir/config/ssl.d/, then deploys it to server_master on 'verify'
[14:15:52]<grobot>hmm, i wonder if the server was missing openssl or something when they tried to set it up
[14:16:13]<grobot>key gen failed perhaps, idk
[14:16:18]<bgm>i presume aegir would trigger an error, but perhaps..
[14:16:23]<grobot>you'd hope :)
[14:16:31]<grobot>highly speculative
[14:16:48]<bgm>:)
[14:20:08]<grobot>can i list queued tasks from drush?
[14:21:05]<bgm>i don't think so
[14:21:30]<grobot>just sqlq hosting_task i guess. looking.
[14:21:49]<grobot>drush @hostmaster hosting-task(s)? gives "invalid command", might need to read and file docs patch
[14:22:18]<bgm>sounds like the install is kind of broken
[14:22:28]<bgm>is it a debian/ubuntu server with the .deb ?
[14:22:31]<grobot>good point, i should check mine
[14:22:44]<grobot>yeah but i don't really trust the admin to have not borkde it
[14:22:52]<bgm>hehe
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[14:23:11]<grobot>actually i've never seen him outside his own irc server :P
[14:23:23]<realityloop>hefring: tell omega8cc https://github.com/omega8cc/nginx-for-drupal/wiki/How-To-Delete-An-Octop... worked for me, thanks
[14:23:23]<hefring>realityloop: I'll pass that on when omega8cc is around.
[14:24:43]<grobot>nah drush @hostmaster help hosting-task gives "invalid cmd" on my aegir
[14:25:15]<grobot>the task is there, just help gives trombone
[14:25:31]<bgm>ah, yeah
[14:25:34]<bgm>same here
[14:26:07]<bgm>offtopic, i officially hate 'deploy'. it's just plain weird.
[14:26:38]<bgm>doing a post_deploy hook, and it still gives me the include paths of the old site, not the new one..
[14:27:36]<grobot>havent had the pleasure
[14:27:47]<grobot>i was wrong, it's 6.x-1.9 not 1.7
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[01:39:44]<theMusician>Does Aegir use it's own rsync command or is it using drush rsync?
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[01:42:54]<wamilton>it uses drush rsync under the hood
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[01:48:04]<theMusician>wamilton: Thanks wamilton. I ask as I am trying to figure out how to have Aegir ignore a few directories when it verifies a site.
[01:48:21]<wamilton>theMusician: like which ones?
[01:49:17]<theMusician>wamilton: A developer uses the css_injector and js_injector modules, so directories of those same names in the files dir of a site.
[01:50:12]<wamilton>theMusician: too clarify, Aegir isn't invoking the drush rsync command on your aliases, so toying with those isn't going to affect the rsync commands it puts together
[01:51:01]<theMusician>wamilton: That is good to know, I probably would have started there. Thanks.
[01:52:05]<wamilton>theMusician: also, why is it important to ignore those directories? Is it because they are created with perms that break the rsync?
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[01:54:30]<theMusician>wamilton: On the live site, those modules write over the existing files that live in those dirs. Initially, Aegir cooperates and copies the files down via verify. However, upon the second verify task, if the files on the live site changed, Aegir recognizes they changed and replaces them with the copy it has. Perfect logic for how Drupal normally operates, under the assumption that anything in the files directory is not being written too.
[01:55:23]<theMusician>wamilton: Unfortunately, that overwrites the changes the site builder made via the gui.
[01:57:13]<wamilton>gross
[01:58:18]<wamilton>yeah, that's definitely ass-backwards; updates to the media files on the remote should definitely be authoritative
[01:58:40]<wamilton>ignoring still sucks because that means you can't back it up
[01:59:09]<wamilton>I seriously can't think of any case where I'd want to undo any change to the remote files dir
[01:59:29]<theMusician>wamilton: :) Yeah. I agree. I think there is a discussion on d.o. for Aegir about the remote media files. Good point about the ignoring not helping because of no backups.
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[02:01:38]<theMusician>http://drupal.org/node/1083366
[02:01:39]<hefring>http://drupal.org/node/1083366 => Dont sync $site/files on verify of a site => Provision, Code, major, needs work, 47 comments, 5 IRC mentions
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[02:10:20]<wamilton>wow, this is horribly ugly
[02:11:12]<wamilton>the funny thing is that it's such a known issue for simple things like imagecache as well
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[02:13:30]<wamilton>before I thought it was just a permissions issue, I didn't know the data was also going the wrong direction
[02:13:46]<theMusician>wamilton: yeah the imagecache one is a pain. Sometimes ctools cache issues crop up too. I hadn't followed the thread for a while but it looks like it moved to http://drupal.org/node/1561102.
[02:13:47]<hefring>http://drupal.org/node/1561102 => Improving sync process between master (hub) and remote (spoke) => Provision, Code, normal, needs review, 6 comments, 5 IRC mentions
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[02:14:08]<wamilton>yeah, I read both
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[02:17:16]<theMusician>wamilton: Looks like the last patch in post #4 fixes existing sites but breaks the creation of new ones. I guess I'll have to apply the patch to our 1.9 test instance and see what happens. Thanks for the brainstorming and helping me remember that I had read about this issue a while ago.
[02:26:34]<wamilton>yeah, they all look pretty stupid
[02:26:54]<wamilton>there's one function doing all of the sync's, and they aren't modifying that schizo shitter
[02:26:59]<wamilton>or I'm missing something
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[02:35:55]<theMusician>wamilton: It really hasn't been much of an issue for me until now. Usually, just rebuilding the image-cache with drush fixes that issue and deleting the cached ctools files fixes that issue. It wasn't until these injector modules appeared. Usually we do most of our development locally, push and pull via git to the hub and then verify changes out to the spokes.
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[04:02:19]<wamilton>mig5, halcyonCorsair, anarcat : if any of you are around can you comment on the sync issues above?
[04:02:55]<wamilton>ergonlogic, darthsteven: ^^
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[04:06:15]<wamilton>specifically, things look pretty spaghetti'd because we're only actually calling sync() on the server context and it's a function that expects to always delete things on the remote that don't exist on the aegir server
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[05:11:06]<halcyonCorsair>wamilton: it's a mess. maybe anarcat's webpack module and mounting files on all servers is the easiest solution
[05:12:29]<wamilton>just in time, I've got another patch!
[05:12:55]<wamilton>http://drupal.org/node/1561102#comment-6143120
[05:12:56]<hefring>http://drupal.org/node/1561102 => Improving sync process between master (hub) and remote (spoke) => Provision, Code, normal, needs review, 6 comments, 6 IRC mentions
[05:13:12]<wamilton>smaller, does less, shouldn't have the error for new sites
[05:13:15]<wamilton>still a mess
[05:13:36]<wamilton>halcyonCorsair: are we running the sync and fetch through the http service just because of pack?
[05:13:51]<wamilton>if so, that seems pretty loose
[05:16:43]<wamilton>theMusician: from your earlier comments, it sounds like you don't have any trouble with rsync and perms for files created on the remote?
[05:16:51]<wamilton>does it 'just work' ?
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[05:37:55]<ergonlogic>wamilton: hi, fwiw I don't use multi-server for pretty much that reason
[05:39:48]<wamilton>ergonlogic: lol
[05:39:51]<ergonlogic>wamilton: in fact, I'm setting up a dual-server (dev & staging/prod) for a client currently, and using two independent aegir servers
[05:40:13]<ergonlogic>wamilton: with hosting_site_import to move sites between
[05:40:49]<wamilton>ergonlogic: so you use puppet or capistrano or something to bundle up the calls to that?
[05:41:14]<ergonlogic>wamilton: nope, I think that'll be manual for now
[05:41:27]<ergonlogic>wamilton: but if there's a need, it'd probably be puppet
[05:41:56]<ergonlogic>since I've developed some expertise in it lately
[05:42:58]<ergonlogic>wamilton: also, I'm just starting on that now, so no real-world experience with it yet
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[05:50:21]<wamilton>ergonlogic: word, I just remember from aegir_up that you seem to be a fan of the puppet
[05:51:22]<ergonlogic>wamilton: definitely, I love Puppet
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[06:11:35]<theMusician>wamilton: Permissions are fine on the remote as aegir is a member of the apache group. Aegir doesn't seem to care who owns the files in the files dir.
[06:13:32]<theMusician>wamilton: I tried the previous patch on 1.9 and it works fine, save some whitespace issues in the patch itself. I did not have an issue creating a new site. I'll try your patch next.
[06:15:57]<wamilton>theMusician: thanks, I'll have to update my Aegirs and test more
[06:18:39]<theMusician>wamilton: thanks for pushing a patch up so quickly. Just rebuilding an Aegir instance to test again.
[06:20:18]<wamilton>theMusician: I've been beating the drum to get Aegir usage institutionalized at my job. This would have been a blow-out if it happened on a live client site since a lot of our clients are doing document management
[06:20:36]<wamilton>so I'm hardly being altruistic :)
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[06:25:02]<theMusician>wamilton: All for one, one for all :)
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[06:25:54]<theMusician>gandhiano: what do you think about this new patch idea, I believe you are the one that was writing the previous patches, no?
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[06:38:21]<wamilton>I'm still sort of reeling from the fact that at a fundamental level drush rsync isn'
[06:39:03]<wamilton>** isn't actually flexible to the point of allowing listeners to alter the modes based on paths or something simple like that
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[06:59:18]<gandhiano>theMusician, hi
[06:59:34]<gandhiano>theMusician, I got the mail notification, but still didn't have time to look at it
[07:00:09]<theMusician>gandhiano: Just saw you logon and wanted to hear your take on it. wamilton and I have discussed it most of the day and then he rolled an alternative patch.
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[07:04:58]<gandhiano>theMusician, wamilton, the patch looks good, although it does not solve the main issue I have, since it only deals with the files/ folder
[07:05:44]<gandhiano>what would you see as an obstacle to have the same behavior for other folders?
[07:07:51]<gandhiano>maybe it's not good to change the behavior now, for 1.x, but for me it makes all the sense that everything on sites/ follows this sync flow - because if one has a remote, then the "some level of user access" will most certainly be at the remote, not at the hostmaster
[07:08:05]<gandhiano>this means the possibility for adding/editing themes, modules, etc.
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[07:08:49]<gandhiano>at the moment, if one adds sth at the remote, then it gets lost or broken (in the case of the themes, what I experience is that the theme gets disabled, because it's not existing on the hostmaster)
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[07:10:16]<gandhiano>so, returning to the central issue, what would be the problem/what problem could be created by doing the first sync of sites/{modules,themes,libraries} from spoke to hub?
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[07:18:43]<gandhiano>anyway, your patch looks really good, very clean - I will probably try to test it with my case (adding the same process to other sites/domain/ subfolders and see if it works properly
[07:18:51]<gandhiano>then we can continue discussing what makes sense
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[07:21:34]<wamilton>gandhiano: I was just trying to whittle the patch down so that anyone on the steering committee would have an easier time passing it
[07:22:28]<wamilton>gandhiano: also, modules and themes in both the all and $url directories can be tricky in a multi-site context, and I don't know if there are any ugly baked-in assumptions for migrate and clone, for example
[07:23:09]<wamilton>gandhiano: my idea was to just restrict it to dealing with one issue, and then expand it to handling the modules and themes and libraries directories if that was deemed appropriate
[07:23:14]<gandhiano>wamilton, yes, these can definitely be a problem and I have not tested or explored enough to know what happens
[07:23:32]<gandhiano>but for the files/ issue alone I think there is already another issue
[07:23:34]<gandhiano>wait
[07:24:00]<gandhiano>http://drupal.org/node/1083366
[07:24:01]<hefring>http://drupal.org/node/1083366 => Dont sync $site/files on verify of a site => Provision, Code, major, needs work, 47 comments, 6 IRC mentions
[07:25:19]<gandhiano>I think we can try to close that one with your patch and then stay on the other for further discussion
[07:25:51]<wamilton>sure, you changed the title of your issue though and it looked like the momemntum was shifting over there is all
[07:26:32]<wamilton>plus, it was your patch that I was changing. But I have no problem with doing it any which way
[07:27:24]<gandhiano>me neither, important is to move forward with these processes
[07:27:58]<wamilton>but yeah, I'm seeing now that both issues actually have to do with the themes directory explicitly, as well as pointing to including modules and libraries in the fix....
[07:28:40]<gandhiano>but I also don't know what are the plans for 2.x, sometime ago anarcat said this whole model with the remotes should change (maybe in the direction of the cluster pack)
[07:28:54]<gandhiano>so it would actually be useful if anarcat could comment on these issues and patches
[07:29:21]<gandhiano>anarcat, http://drupal.org/node/1561102
[07:29:22]<hefring>http://drupal.org/node/1561102 => Improving sync process between master (hub) and remote (spoke) => Provision, Code, normal, needs review, 7 comments, 7 IRC mentions
[07:30:30]<gandhiano>it might make no sense to spend a lot of energy here if 1.x is blocking changes in behavior and 2.x solving them
[07:31:23]<wamilton>well, I need something that doesn't blow up client docs as soon as a couple months ago, so I think it's fair to agitate for this getting into 1.x
[07:31:38]<wamilton>not losing themes is also legit
[07:33:03]<gandhiano>yes, especially because theme editor module is not yet up to the task on d7 - so there is no alternative to let a user edit themes than actually changing directly the theme
[07:33:22]<gandhiano>going now
[07:33:35]<wamilton>k
[07:33:53]<gandhiano>wamilton, theMusician, thanks for the patch and putting some energy on this one - my next weeks are pretty busy, but I hope to come back to this at some point
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[07:53:00]<wamilton>theMusician: if you test this and it works, please update the issue I posted the patch in to RTBC
[07:53:07]<wamilton>that should get some more visibility
[07:53:35]<wamilton>...and you're the only party that's on board so far and hasn't written any of the code...
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[08:44:46]<halcyonCorsair>wamilton: you don't run the sync with pack because you have the same files mounted on the different servers
[08:45:18]<halcyonCorsair>via nfs or something
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