| [10:02:01] | <ergonlogic> | anarcat: yeah, I saw that |
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| [10:54:43] | <Deciphered> | ergonlogic: anarcat: Thoughts? darthsteven thinks it's out of scope. I'm biased... but I don't know how well it'll go in a seperate project. |
| [10:54:43] | <hefring> | Deciphered: 2 days 18 hours ago <ergonlogic> tell Deciphered Unfortunately, our sessions were refused again, so I won't be going to DC Portland. But, anarcat's going, and that's even better, imho. |
| [10:55:03] | <anarcat> | what about? |
| [10:55:12] | <Deciphered> | anarcat: http://drupal.org/node/1988728 |
| [10:55:13] | <hefring> | http://drupal.org/node/1988728 => Allow makefiles for sites. [#1988728] => Hostmaster (Aegir), Code, normal, needs review, 2 comments, 2 IRC mentions |
| [10:55:27] | <anarcat> | Deciphered: i think you should talk with ergonlogic about this |
| [10:55:39] | <anarcat> | i do think it's not for 1.x, that's for sure |
| [10:55:42] | <anarcat> | and it's a bit late for 2.x |
| [10:55:54] | <anarcat> | i'd prefer to see views finished :) |
| [10:56:29] | <Deciphered> | anarcat: yeah, never considered for 1.x. And yeah, I think Views trumps. I think there's only minimal left in that, such as the Bulk Operations for platforms. |
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| [14:36:11] | <ergonlogic> | DecipheredAFK: hi |
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| [14:44:06] | <Deciphered> | ergonlogic: back now. |
| [14:44:23] | <ergonlogic> | Deciphered: hey, great! |
| [14:44:36] | <ergonlogic> | re. http://drupal.org/node/1988728 |
| [14:44:36] | <hefring> | http://drupal.org/node/1988728 => Allow makefiles for sites. [#1988728] => Hostmaster (Aegir), Code, normal, needs review, 3 comments, 3 IRC mentions |
| [14:45:19] | <ergonlogic> | I essentially agree with Steven that's it's out of scope for Aegir core |
| [14:45:33] | <ergonlogic> | as far as I understand it's purpose |
| [14:46:53] | <Deciphered> | Sure. My biggest concern about it being outside of aegir is really about timing, but I haven't testes that approach yet. Basically, it triggers a make command during the install task, which has a little bit of code that's supposed to be run once all file system modifications have been made, but I'm sure it's not a major issue |
| [14:47:36] | <ergonlogic> | post-install is too late? |
| [14:48:09] | <Deciphered> | ergonlogic: My point is obviously for sandboxes, but as far as it relates to core aegir, I atleast know of people who use non-profile based makefiles, and have all there modules/themes in the site specific folder, this would allow for that to be done via a makefile directly inside of Aegir |
| [14:48:50] | <Deciphered> | ergonlogic: I don't think it would be too late, but as I said, I haven't tested that approach yet, first thought was just to make it core. |
| [14:49:26] | <ergonlogic> | so, explain "non-profile based makefiles", please |
| [14:49:52] | <ergonlogic> | you're referring to mig5's dev process, I take it? |
| [14:50:57] | <ergonlogic> | you mean custom, site-specific modules/themes? |
| [14:51:06] | <ergonlogic> | or regular contrib ones? |
| [14:51:11] | <Deciphered> | ergonlogic: Just a no-core makefile, so purely modules and themes. Yeah, migs approach (and Realityloops) is profile makefile based, this alternative is so that you could have multi-site setup on a generic platform and still use a makefile to populate the modules/themes for a specific site, not for the overall platform |
| [14:52:15] | <Deciphered> | For me, it's about sandboxes and module dev, if I want to work on a specific module i haven't worked on for a while, and test i inside the latest stable Drupal core, this approach allows me to roll up a sandbox for that module and have a makefile that has all of the dependencies and optional modules for testing purposes |
| [14:52:45] | <ergonlogic> | but we're still talking about just for initial site build? |
| [14:53:00] | <Deciphered> | Also, having a dev makefile that contains Devel, Coder, etc, so I can have a dev site in a platform without having those modules available to the whole platform. |
| [14:53:28] | <Deciphered> | Yes, but just for the site. |
| [14:54:08] | <ergonlogic> | I tend to think we're better off isolating dev from production |
| [14:54:30] | <ergonlogic> | and this would seem to go in the other direction, no? |
| [14:55:03] | <Deciphered> | Not necessarily, this is just one single usecase. The point isn't to force anything on anyone, but allow for additional flexibility |
| [14:56:21] | <Deciphered> | Think of this scenario: I have a generic, SAAS platform, build from a Profile based makefile, and that's fine for 90% of my clients, but then say that 10% of my clients have paid extra for additional modules. I can either break them out onto a custom platform, or I can use a makefile during the generation of their site and have them on that platform plus the additional modules as per the second makefile |
| [14:56:46] | <ergonlogic> | I definitely see its worth for dev/testing |
| [14:57:07] | <ergonlogic> | but in that scenario, how would we update those 10% extra modules? |
| [14:57:45] | <Deciphered> | One thing that did occur to me is that if anything it should probably be optional functionality (experimental feature) in Hostmaster, so it could be turned on if people want it, without splitting it out of Hostmaster itself |
| [14:58:38] | <Deciphered> | While I haven't started messing with that, I did consider that it could be possible to allow them to re-run the makefile at verify or similar |
| [15:00:42] | <Deciphered> | Also, it was partially inspired by the idea behind Simplytest.me, I do have plans at some stage to create a makefile UI module for Aegir, allow makefiles to be created inside Aegir and saved. It would allow a module to be added to a site at any stage once theres some form of post-install re-make process |
| [15:01:50] | <ergonlogic> | would you be terribly disappointed if I suggested that you work on it in contrib, and we re-visit once it's matured a bit? |
| [15:02:07] | <ergonlogic> | I see value in it |
| [15:02:20] | <ergonlogic> | and we have at least one client for whom it could be interesting |
| [15:02:42] | <Deciphered> | Not at all, I can see how at the same time it's not core functionality, especially for prod. |
| [15:03:24] | <ergonlogic> | good, we all really appreciate your contributions, and I didn't want you to feel alienated over this :) |
| [15:04:26] | <Deciphered> | Heh, no, don't worry about that, Aegir is an essential tool for me, it'll take a lot to alienate me from it :) |
| [15:04:36] | <ergonlogic> | I think making it a hosting feature is a good idea |
| [15:04:58] | <ergonlogic> | and you might want to consider adding a permission too |
| [15:05:19] | <ergonlogic> | since, I can imagine it could be confusing to some users |
| [15:05:51] | <ergonlogic> | we're working on something along similar lines in valkyrie |
| [15:06:22] | <ergonlogic> | but we just just put the site under git |
| [15:06:54] | <ergonlogic> | and allow site-specific modules to be updated by the dev, using 'drush dl' or whatever |
| [15:07:11] | <Deciphered> | I was hoping to talk to you about some other stuff as well, nows not exactly the time, but just to keep it in mind, I was thinking that an additional layer, potenitally Project, should be added to Aegir, which is a parent of Platforms, as per mig5s process, all platforms of a single project could be grouped together, as it's something that I think is necessary for the work I've done for Aegir automation via Services, Ru |
| [15:07:11] | <Deciphered> | les and a post-update trigger. |
| [15:07:23] | <ergonlogic> | site-specific makefiles would be an interesting addition |
| [15:07:36] | <Deciphered> | But, as I said, now's not the best time as I've got a lot of other important stuff, so that's just a teaser |
| [15:07:59] | <ergonlogic> | yeah... have you seen devshop? |
| [15:08:05] | <Deciphered> | I have not |
| [15:08:08] | <ergonlogic> | they have a 'project' context |
| [15:08:32] | <Deciphered> | Interesting, I will definetely have to take a look at that |
| [15:08:41] | <ergonlogic> | I think we definitely need to work out relationships between platforms |
| [15:09:48] | <ergonlogic> | so, as for adding 'updatability' to site-specific makefiles... |
| [15:10:09] | <ergonlogic> | I recently added an 'update' task to hosting_task_extras |
| [15:11:02] | <ergonlogic> | the main point is to provide a convenient hook in which to do a 'git pull', for our valkyrie stuff |
| [15:11:03] | <Deciphered> | Well in that case, it might make as much sense to make the site-specific makefiles stuff part of hosting_task_extras as per darthsteven's original suggestion, as that would definetely be of use |
| [15:12:10] | <ergonlogic> | I could see updating makefile-based modules working similarly |
| [15:12:46] | <ergonlogic> | but then, I think the site makefile field would have to be editable, I guess |
| [15:12:52] | <ergonlogic> | so it could be updated |
| [15:13:05] | <ergonlogic> | maybe in a task confirmation form? |
| [15:13:30] | <ergonlogic> | anyway, I think it'd have to be thought through a bit more |
| [15:14:09] | <Deciphered> | Yeah, but I think that's the right direction (if it's not going to be a core appraoch). I'll probably have a play over the next few days. |
| [15:15:04] | <Deciphered> | As per the Views stuff, what are you're thoughts on that patch? I know there's still a little more work needed to be done, but it's becoming a behemoth, and as it is it's 99% functional |
| [15:15:44] | <ergonlogic> | so, hosting_tasks_extra is intended (afaict) to hold non-core tasks, whereas, you're looking at a new site field |
| [15:15:54] | <ergonlogic> | I'm not really sure it works there, either |
| [15:15:56] | <Deciphered> | The main thing I can think of that still needs work is the Bulk operations, specifically that there are no operations available for platforms yet, but also the look and feel is a bit underwhelming |
| [15:16:23] | <ergonlogic> | I'm for merging the views stuff |
| [15:16:34] | <ergonlogic> | do you have that in a git sandbox? |
| [15:16:55] | <ergonlogic> | it might be easier to review your dev branch, rather than a great big patch :) |
| [15:17:08] | <Deciphered> | Nope, just as the patch. Some of it was in your sandbox, but I wasn't sure that that sandbox was uptodate enough just recently. |
| [15:17:28] | <ergonlogic> | yeah, I haven't been pulling in updates recently |
| [15:17:46] | <ergonlogic> | anarcat and I will be working on Aegir together on Friday |
| [15:17:55] | <Deciphered> | I can put it into a sandbox tonight if that works for you better |
| [15:18:08] | <ergonlogic> | and I think he's pretty keen to see views land sooner, rather than later |
| [15:18:20] | <ergonlogic> | don't bother |
| [15:18:27] | <Deciphered> | K |
| [15:18:28] | <ergonlogic> | we'll work it out |
| [15:18:43] | <ergonlogic> | his git fu is much stronger than mine :) |
| [15:19:07] | <Deciphered> | Let me know how you go, and feel free to ping me, my bouncer is on 99% of the time, and it'll ping my phone. |
| [15:19:52] | <ergonlogic> | I'm not sure whether we'll try to get it into alpha2, or add it right after |
| [15:20:17] | <ergonlogic> | probably the former |
| [15:20:20] | <ergonlogic> | k |
| [15:20:33] | <ergonlogic> | you're in Australia, right? |
| [15:21:03] | <Deciphered> | ergonlogic: Indeed, 3:20pm atm |
| [15:21:27] | <ergonlogic> | yeah, 1:25am here |
| [15:22:20] | <Deciphered> | Heh, that's dedication :) Better let you go then hey. But yeah, ping me if you need to chat about the Views stuff on Friday |
| [15:22:49] | <ergonlogic> | sure thing |
| [15:22:56] | <realityloop> | Deciphered: don't forget ergonlogic's Friday is our Saturday |
| [15:23:03] | <ergonlogic> | I'll be chekcing out http://drupal.org/project/which_feature too :) |
| [15:23:17] | <ergonlogic> | hi realityloop |
| [15:23:22] | <Deciphered> | realityloop: I know, didn't say I'd answer the ping :) |
| [15:23:23] | <realityloop> | ergonlogic: hi |
| [15:23:29] | <ergonlogic> | I'm sure we'll work it out :) |
| [15:23:45] | <ergonlogic> | that what issue queues are for |
| [15:23:48] | <realityloop> | no doubt |
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| [15:58:28] | <darthsteven> | Just going to look a Jenkins and Java on the ci server |
| [15:58:29] | <darthsteven> | so Jenkins may go down for a bit |
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| [00:43:49] | <chertzog> | is it possible to disable the SSL setup that BOA installs by default |
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| [02:08:07] | <ergonlogic> | chertzog: you're probably going to have better luck with BOA questions in #omega8cc |
| [02:08:30] | <chertzog> | ok thanks |
| [02:09:28] | <benjf> | why isn |
| [02:09:32] | <benjf> | bah |
| [02:09:55] | <benjf> | why isn't that channel named something like #aegir-boa or #drupal-boa? seems odd to me |
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| [02:10:17] | <benjf> | (i actually thought it was a support channel for omega8.cc hosting - doh) |
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| [02:49:18] | <ergonlogic> | benjf: it is |
| [02:49:34] | <ergonlogic> | darthsteven: ping |
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| [04:03:38] | <helmo> | ergonlogic: Are you using valkyrie with Aegir 1.x or 2.x? |
| [04:03:51] | <ergonlogic> | helmo: up to now 1.x |
| [04:04:12] | <ergonlogic> | helmo: but I figured to help with the 2.x port |
| [04:04:45] | <helmo> | I've also started a 2.x branch in my sandbox |
| [04:05:03] | <helmo> | devshop seems to need only a little patching for 2.x |
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| [04:06:09] | <ergonlogic> | are you moving to the class auto-loading? |
| [04:06:40] | <ergonlogic> | I'm having some trouble with that in provision_civicrm |
| [04:07:12] | <helmo> | I'm not activly moving.... only one class needed a rename |
| [04:07:20] | <helmo> | https://drupal.org/sandbox/helmo/1868804 |
| [04:09:27] | <ergonlogic> | hmm, I'm having trouble spotting the relevant commit here: http://drupalcode.org/sandbox/helmo/1868804.git/shortlog/refs/heads/6.x-2.x |
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| [04:10:31] | <helmo> | strange, I'll check... |
| [04:10:32] | <helmo> | I've granted you access to the sandboxes... |
| [04:11:02] | <ergonlogic> | cool, thanks |
| [04:11:13] | <ergonlogic> | helmo: can I get your opinion on http://drupal.org/node/1915854 ? |
| [04:11:13] | <hefring> | http://drupal.org/node/1915854 => Support building platforms from makefiles [#1915854] => DevShop, devshop_projects, normal, needs review, 3 comments, 1 IRC mention |
| [04:11:51] | <ergonlogic> | in valkyrie, we're only keeping the site dir under git |
| [04:12:20] | <ergonlogic> | based on the approach mentioned in that issue, to allow overriding the built-in functionality |
| [04:13:01] | <ergonlogic> | it worked well, though I suspect we'll need to re-roll the patches, since devshop has moved a lot since then |
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| [04:15:01] | <helmo> | I'll have to look into that ... but I really see the bennefit of a site-repo. |
| [04:15:51] | <helmo> | that matches better with aegir core... I'd like to add Devshop to my hostmaster without having to create a project for every site |
| [04:16:24] | <ergonlogic> | yeah, I seriously considered your hosting_site_git, but projects/environments are a great feature of devshop |
| [04:16:32] | <ergonlogic> | exactly |
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| [04:17:47] | <ergonlogic> | valkyrie's not complete yet (by a long shot), but the idea is to be able to spin up a project when needed, but otherwise be able to treat a site in production normally |
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| [04:18:47] | <ergonlogic> | and use the new 'update' task in hosting_task_extras to hang a hook to do a 'git pull' |
| [04:19:11] | <ergonlogic> | after update's backup, so we still have a rollback |
| [04:20:00] | <ergonlogic> | anyway, dev had paused while I went down to the CiviCRM conference, and worked on provision_civicrm at the week-long sprint following that |
| [04:20:09] | <ergonlogic> | but I'm gearing up to start again |
| [04:22:21] | <ergonlogic> | we also want to be able to support projects across multiple servers |
| [04:22:45] | <ergonlogic> | so that we can develop on an aegir-up variant |
| [04:22:51] | <ergonlogic> | test on a dedicated ci server |
| [04:23:04] | <ergonlogic> | and only keep production sites on a prod server |
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| [04:32:05] | <helmo> | that's very similar to where I would like to go |
| [04:32:43] | <helmo> | I see that I had forgotten to push the relevant devshop_provision commit... It's there now |
| [04:32:47] | <ergonlogic> | ok, well, how about I give you access to the valkyrie repos, then? |
| [04:32:52] | <ergonlogic> | k, I'll take a look |
| [04:32:59] | <helmo> | Sounds great |
| [04:34:01] | <ergonlogic> | done |
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| [04:40:41] | <ergonlogic> | hmm, in |
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| [04:40:57] | <ergonlogic> | provision_civicrm, I moved to class auto-loading too |
| [04:41:50] | <ergonlogic> | not sure if it's related, but in a hook_post_provision_install(), I don't see the values I've saved into the site context |
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| [04:43:07] | <ergonlogic> | they're in the site alias... |
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| [07:03:29] | <helmo> | hefring: tell darthsteven Could you review https://drupal.org/node/1953286 ? It's minor but I would like to get the 2.x Aegir stable |
| [07:03:29] | <hefring> | helmo: I'll pass that on when darthsteven is around. |
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| [07:50:43] | <Ogredude> | okay now that I have it up and running and have figured out (mostly) how to work with it, I have to say... Aegir is absolutely freaking fantastic! |
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